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MaGMML2 - RELEASE, GO TO THE WEBSITE
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lizardcommando Offline
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Post: #301
RE: MaGMML2 - Rules + Discussion. JUDGING COMPLETE, GAME SOON (?)!!
If you've got a ton of content to film, wouldn't you want to break it up into smaller chunks? The bottom tier goes first, then the next tier, etc.
04-04-2017 04:38 AM
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awd42 Offline
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Post: #302
RE: MaGMML2 - Rules + Discussion. JUDGING COMPLETE, GAME SOON (?)!!
The livestream for the MaGMML1 results was 4-1/2 hours, IIRC, and I think Flashman85 was feeling pretty fatigued by the end of it (and also some people had to leave, or get there late, etc.), so I don't think a marathon stream is the best idea (unless it were a big team event with people trading off playing the game) . But that was for just 20 levels (plus 4 tier bosses) -- with 81 levels (plus 9 tier bosses?), that would extrapolate to 18 hours of streaming!

Even if broken into six 3-hour streams, that's a lot. While completely showing off every level would make a great let's play series for the hardcore fans, that's still a lot to watch (not to mention play and record etc. on his end)!

I agree that rushing through the levels would not the most enjoyable way to play... but, if this is supposed to be the grand revelation of the results, I think the results show should be of a reasonable length (and they say the Oscars are too long!). Here's my idea: have a results show (or probably two, depending on length) where you announce the results and sample each level for a few minutes, and then a let's play series where you play 100% of the game.

Even with e.g. a 3-minute timer, that's still four hours, plus hub time, reading judge comments, breaks, etc., so probably 5+ hours. Thing is, with all the custom bosses, you'd really need to fight the boss to fully experience the levels and understand judges' comments, even if you didn't reach them in the allotted time. If it's not too much trouble for Pyro et al to add a teleporter to each level's boss corridor at the beginning of that level, then you could move on to the boss fight when the level timer beeps. (Eh, who am I kidding, of course it's a lot of trouble -- even if it only took one minute per level to put that in, that's still a lot of work!)

Maybe I'm over-thinking it, but I do enjoy your live streams whenever I can catch them, especially for something as exciting as this, and that's not just watching the content, but interacting in the chat, etc., too. I can block off 5 hours for watching results streams live if I know in advance, but catching all of a 20-hour playthrough live probably isn't gonna happen. If the LP was a series on YouTube then I wouldn't feel like I was missing out if I saw the video a day or two later, since there's still the YouTube comments (which despite being a cesspool in general, are usually pretty good on your videos).

Halfway through this post I switched from 3rd person to 2nd person, (mostly) addressing Flashman85 directly. Meh, let's roll with it...
04-04-2017 04:44 AM
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Alienoid Offline
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Post: #303
RE: MaGMML2 - Rules + Discussion. JUDGING COMPLETE, GAME SOON (?)!!
At first I was going to suggest that all the results should be revealed in an official announcement post (since that is a lot of levels to live stream, and I'm an impatient little turd), but I really do like the idea of the bottom tiers being announced earlier and the upper tiers being announced via livestream. Granted, I still want to see the bottom tier levels livestreamed.

I really don't think a super-mega-long marathon livestream is a good idea. Chopping it up into a bunch of regular-sized streams sounds like a way safer idea, mentally speaking.
04-04-2017 05:02 AM
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Entity1037 Offline
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Post: #304
RE: MaGMML2 - Rules + Discussion. JUDGING COMPLETE, GAME SOON (?)!!
Just giving out an official announcement does ruin the fun of being in anticipation of where you'll be placed when watching the stream. It'll become less about experiencing as a community the fun of seeing where everyone placed and how things ended up, to everyone sort of learning about it separately as they read the results by themselves. And it would make the stream itself kind of weird. The scores and judge comments would spoil what each stage is about and what's in them. And, since you would already know the results, the main purpose of streaming before the game is released would sort of become about revealing what the levels actually are, and to connect the dots of the results with the levels themselves, which is something people might rather do themselves, and not have ruined by a stream.

One, monstrous livestream would probably just be way to much. No one would be able to go through the entire thing, and it would end up just being plain inconvenient, along with probably tiring the heck out of everyone involved. You could go through and not look at the entirety of the levels, and the hub, but as was said, a lot of the fun was just experiencing everything in the game, and how everything came together, and just only focusing on the results would be counter-intuitive to that. And plus I feel like some people would be disappointed about not seeing all of a level, or not seeing flashman's / everyone's reactions to a part of their own level.

Having a bunch more livestreams of normal length could make it more likely to cause schedule problems for people with at least one of the streams, and have people miss one. Plus I feel like drawing it out over a longer period of time could potentially make the results streams lose steam or excitement over time.

I think the best way to do this is to do a few, longer livestreams, make sure to schedule them on days most people will be free, and announce when they're happening in advance so people can schedule for them. This way we have time to really look at what the game has to offer, it won't potentially be too drawn out and lose steam, and we won't have so many streams as to eventually cause schedule conflicts.

EDIT:

I feel like revealing only a part of the results before the stream(s) could possibly work, but I sort of feel like only revealing part of them is kind of arbitrary, and a tease. Almost feels like it's intentionally getting you to go through a hoop and invest yourself in some unrelated thing the developers want you to invest in just to get the rest of what you should have already gotten. And if the levels the results were revealed for do still get played on stream, then revealing only a part of the results before the stream could feel kind of pointless, or sort of like a spoiler.

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(This post was last modified: 04-04-2017 05:46 AM by Entity1037.)
04-04-2017 05:14 AM
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Jimmy Turner Offline
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Post: #305
RE: MaGMML2 - Rules + Discussion. JUDGING COMPLETE, GAME SOON (?)!!
Hello Sprites Inc. I'm completely new to this site so please don't take this too hard on me. I'm actually very excited to play the sequel to Make a Good Mega Man Level Contest. However, I'm not trying to rush you; please take your time and build you game until it is fully completed. I just want everyone to have the same excitement as I do.

For my opinions on the first game, it was an out of the park experience. In other words, this game was awesome. If I had to choose my least and favorite levels, my least favorite would be "Hard to See Land" by ParmaJon, and my favorite would be "Neon Gravity" by Friendly Dictator. I might put my opinions later on. Now here are my expectations for the seconod MAGMMLC:

Main Hub: The first game took place in Dr. Light's labs. I was just curious if it will be the same, different, or a revamped version of Light Labs.

Tier Bosses: According to Pyro, he said there are going to be 9 tier bosses. So if I had to do the math, (81 levels and 9 tier bosses) there is going to be approximately 8 levels and 10 tiers. I might be wrong but this was my best guess. About the bosses, are they going to be fan game bosses as well? If so, I would really like to see bosses from many more fan games that you guys haven't explored (FlashMan might have played the games). There's a wide variety of fan games to be found, even cancelled, work in progress, or demo ones.

Robot Masters (for fun and/or tips): In the first game, random robot masters spawn everywhere and sometimes they give you some tips or they can just have a chat with you. Will this return?

Rush Jet: The first game's rush jet is absolutely horrible and seriously flawed. I hope the second game will get this fixed because I was expecting Rush Jet to be good since it was the most used utility in official Mega Man games.

And that's about it. I wish you the best of luck to get this game finally polished so we can all play it, especially Flash Man who will stream it. But believe me, this guy is even more excited than I am. Have fun! Big Grin
04-04-2017 06:54 AM
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Entity1037 Offline
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Post: #306
RE: MaGMML2 - Rules + Discussion. JUDGING COMPLETE, GAME SOON (?)!!
Not sure if I can say anything about the main hub. There are 8 levels in each of the 10 tiers (one level got disqualified, and is in its own section thing if I recall correctly), with all tiers having a boss except for the final one. The tier bosses are fan-game robot masters. And, we've had a functional Rush Jet since the beginning of the project pretty much.

Also, Pyro is a she. :Y

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04-04-2017 07:38 AM
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ACESpark Offline
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Post: #307
RE: MaGMML2 - Rules + Discussion. JUDGING COMPLETE, GAME SOON (?)!!
In regards to the Flash Man streams: Multiple streams, definitely. I feel showcasing the game to the best of your abilities would be for the best, personally.
Maybe... release the lower tier results? It's not too bad an idea although I wonder if the judge comments should be given out at the same time... because I'd rather have mine shown off on stream if we can at all help it. ;V

(This post was last modified: 04-04-2017 08:45 AM by ACESpark.)
04-04-2017 08:42 AM
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ParmaJon Offline
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Post: #308
RE: MaGMML2 - Rules + Discussion. JUDGING COMPLETE, GAME SOON (?)!!
(04-04-2017 06:54 AM)Jimmy Turner Wrote:  If I had to choose my least and favorite levels, my least favorite would be "Hard to See Land" by ParmaJon,

Well shit



Honestly i think this should be a series of normal length streams and flashman should be able to take time for each entry without the rush of a defined schedule, so that while some people may miss it, there is a higher quality to the streams as a whole.

Also as a note to flashman, im going to guess that the pit will take a full stream at least, as it is at about 120 entries atm.
(This post was last modified: 04-04-2017 11:44 AM by ParmaJon.)
04-04-2017 11:42 AM
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Cruise Elroy Offline
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Post: #309
RE: MaGMML2 - Rules + Discussion. JUDGING COMPLETE, GAME SOON (?)!!
I was thinking it may be best to split the streams into tiers, so we'd probably end up with the results being streamed one tier per day.

Of course, that's just my personal preference, so whatever ends up working is fine by me too (however, I would be in favor of not rushing through the levels just to get it done).
04-04-2017 12:31 PM
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Beed28 Offline
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Post: #310
RE: MaGMML2 - Rules + Discussion. JUDGING COMPLETE, GAME SOON (?)!!
I was thinking, if we go through with the multiple livestreams, have the judges post the results and their comments for the levels that were streamed so far. Then if anyone's missed a stream, they can still catch up on the judges' scores and comments (and of course, there's the Flashman85 LIVE YouTube channel where he archives his streams).
04-04-2017 01:29 PM
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SnoruntPyro Offline
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Post: #311
RE: MaGMML2 - Rules + Discussion. JUDGING COMPLETE, GAME SOON (?)!!
@cruise elroy ^ the one issue with that is due to how tier 1 ended up it will probably take like 20 minutes total to play, lol. So maybe the streams could be formatted like

- Hub, Tiers 1 and 2
- Tier 3 + 4 (tier 3 has some pretty horrible levels so this stream might be long)
- Tier 5, 6, 7
- Tier 8, 9, 10
- Wily Castle
- Pit
- Postgame

I'd say that if you did 100% these would probably all be from 2 to 4 hours?

Also @Jimmy Turner: the hub will be totally different but the current plan is that you'll be able to visit light labs alongside the main hub. Entity said the rest of the stuff. And yeah *she lol.

@beed I was gonna do that (post revealed results) regardless of the stream plans so yeah
(This post was last modified: 04-04-2017 01:32 PM by SnoruntPyro.)
04-04-2017 01:30 PM
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Zieldak Offline
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Post: #312
RE: MaGMML2 - Rules + Discussion. JUDGING COMPLETE, GAME SOON (?)!!
Honestly, for a results stream, going through Tier 10, listing the Tier 1-9 places so they're not left out, and mentioning that postgame stuff exist would be fine... or doing a REALLY LONG series... which would be painful for him considering the game is already 6 times larger (4x more levels, and a ton of extra content) than the first game was.

Or maybe we could do what NaOH suggested, break it up and have different streamers for each day.
(This post was last modified: 04-04-2017 02:49 PM by Zieldak.)
04-04-2017 02:45 PM
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Kunosachiaka Offline
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Post: #313
RE: MaGMML2 - Rules + Discussion. JUDGING COMPLETE, GAME SOON (?)!!
Having one giant stream is only going to hurt the quality of the stream and might be a bit of a nightmare for Flashman. Plus, it really wouldn't be fair for the higher ranked stages as he'll be tired and less enthused to give an optimistic view. I personally assumed I would know the results at least for my own stage before going into the game myself, and I was ok with this.

I like the idea of breaking the stream up into bite-sized portions. A few hours one day, a few hours another day, and continuing so on until all the stages have been beaten. This should not only be much more manageable for Flashman himself, but also for the viewers who also have a busy schedule, and it should help keep the content at a high quality so it's enjoyable to watch as well.
04-04-2017 03:17 PM
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TheFallenAlchemist Offline
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Post: #314
RE: MaGMML2 - Rules + Discussion. JUDGING COMPLETE, GAME SOON (?)!!
I personally won't be able to watch the live streams due to having limited mobile, but I am honestly more interested in playing through the levels myself. A stream of most of the game before release seems a bit spoilery, despite the contest nature of it. Thanks, but I'll just wait a while longer.

Yeah, I review stuff: http://thegrimtower.com
04-04-2017 04:50 PM
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Flashman85 Offline
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Post: #315
RE: MaGMML2 - Rules + Discussion. JUDGING COMPLETE, GAME SOON (?)!!
I appreciate the concern for my well-being that I'm seeing here. Smile

It's sounding like the general consensus is to do a series of normal-length results streams, and I'm on board with that. I was already planning on streaming the game in its entirety no matter how the results were announced. I feel like it would be disruptive (or at least weird) to have multiple streamers and to release only part of the results in advance—an all-or-nothing approach seems best to me.

Depending on when the game is ready to stream, I could probably do a Friday + Saturday + Sunday series to sample all the submitted levels. (Alternately, I could skip Friday and instead do two streams on Saturday with a break in the middle.) That way we'd have all the results announced by the end of a single weekend, and then the game could be made public as I stream the rest of the game at my leisure. No need to delay the official release until I've played the ENTIRE game.

In case anyone hasn't played MaGMML1 or is curious to see what the results stream looked like, my playthrough is archived here. I'm planning on following the same format this time, but I'll probably spend less time retrying levels before moving on.

No matter where you go, there you are.
04-04-2017 05:14 PM
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Beed28 Offline
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Post: #316
RE: MaGMML2 - Rules + Discussion. JUDGING COMPLETE, GAME SOON (?)!!
In MaGMML1, the Wily Stages weren't even finished when Flashman did his results stream. Will this be the case here as well (i.e. focusing more on the hubs and tier bosses and then finishing up the Wily Stages and other postgame stuff afterwards)?
04-04-2017 06:23 PM
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M-Jacq Offline
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Post: #317
RE: MaGMML2 - Rules + Discussion. JUDGING COMPLETE, GAME SOON (?)!!
(04-04-2017 06:23 PM)Beed28 Wrote:  In MaGMML1, the Wily Stages weren't even finished when Flashman did his results stream. Will this be the case here as well (i.e. focusing more on the hubs and tier bosses and then finishing up the Wily Stages and other postgame stuff afterwards)?
Yes.
04-04-2017 06:25 PM
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Post: #318
RE: MaGMML2 - Rules + Discussion. JUDGING COMPLETE, GAME SOON (?)!!
I'm totally ok with splitting the results stream into multiple parts, but I would suggest posting whatever results were seen in each part after that part is complete. So say the first part is Tiers 1 and 2, post those results once that part of the stream is done. This way, people who can't watch the stream for whatever reason can still keep up with what results have been announced up to that point.
04-04-2017 09:40 PM
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Duck Salmon Offline
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Post: #319
RE: MaGMML2 - Rules + Discussion. JUDGING COMPLETE, GAME SOON (?)!!
In my opinion, it'd be better to put half of the levels (the bottom tiers) in a giant room like the Judge Room (u can see that in the Ace_Spark Video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3g3Dyd04vtc)
and for the others create an hub and a background "story" like the one of the first MaGMMlC 1

And for the stream, maybe is better to split it in more parts.
05-04-2017 07:27 PM
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Zieldak Offline
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Post: #320
RE: MaGMML2 - Rules + Discussion. JUDGING COMPLETE, GAME SOON (?)!!
(05-04-2017 07:27 PM)Duck Salmon Wrote:  it'd be better to put half of the levels [...] and for the others create an hub and a background "story" like the one of the first MaGMMlC 1

That won't happen, because that would be just throwing a lot of stuff out the window.
(This post was last modified: 05-04-2017 07:54 PM by Zieldak.)
05-04-2017 07:53 PM
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